...? Can someone explain this for me...

Standout · #1 2007-09-17, 16:09

Are we all the same at birth? Aren't we all born into this world with the same brain side from genetics, which we have no control over? This brain is then influenced by culture, enviornment, laws and norms etc. we are born into and have no control over, right?

All of the aforementioned prevent everyone from doing things that they want, doesn't this really fence in free will? Even free thought to a degree, can't someone with proper genetics and enviornment achieve much more sophistocated levels of free thought compared to one who is not born into a 'supportive' enviornment?

All of our memories, the past only exist because we do correct? Because our brains percieve this reality and past events a certain unique way (shaped by uncontrollable factors, eliminating our 'unique' personality?) but when we die there is nothing to suggest all of this thought does not cease to exist. Is this what faith is? Where does the idea of anything metaphysical come into play?

Basically don't we all start life and finish it exactly the same as everyone else, and everything in between that makes us 'unique' is highly subjective to factors outside of our control. Isn't everything in between meaningless since once we die we only exist in the memories of those who are alive?

Kind of depressing when I have been taught the majority of my life that the deceased are in some happy land for all of eternity.

Tyrant · #2 2007-09-17, 17:12

Only if you're playing World of Warcraft.

ArmsMerchant · #3 2007-09-17, 19:23

We are born no way close to being equal.

Ever hear of FAL-- or Down'sdSyndrome--or any of a bazallion of other genetic "defects" which give us different neural wetware?

KikoSanchez · #4 2007-09-17, 20:43

No, we're not all born the same - by any measure.
Yes, we don't have free will.
Yes, we just cease to exist once cessation is reached by the brain.
No, it is not at all depressing. Why the hell would you want to have to exist for ETERNITY? THAT would be depressing/scary as shit.

Standout · #5 2007-09-17, 21:59

Well when I said we all start out the same side from genetics I was trying to get at how that could remove everything that makes us 'who we are'.

We come out of the womb stamped with a race, gender etc that all shape the way we view things as well as enviornmental factors, all outside our control right? Are we just animals percieving this reality through specefic genetics combined with specefic enviornmental factors that give us the illusion we are 'unique' or that our consciousness has some sort of value once we are dead?

That is what I meant by saying 'are we all the same at birth'...meaning the instant we are born besides genetics we all view the world the same way, but from that moment on factors outside of our control shape that view of the world for us thus making us think we are unique or have a personality? Is it that simple? I don't understand where anything metaphysical comes into play.

AngryFemme · #6 2007-09-17, 22:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Standout

I don't understand where anything metaphysical comes into play.

It's completely unnecessary to believe that anything metaphysical has to come into play. I think you paraphrased your own answer nicely with this:

Are we just animals percieving this reality through specefic genetics combined with specefic enviornmental factors that give us the illusion we are 'unique' or that our consciousness has some sort of value once we are dead?

Believing that our consciousness somehow survives our death is just a soothing comfort blanket for those who cannot fathom that one day they will cease to be.

At least, that's my take on it.

Standout · #7 2007-09-17, 23:32

Hm I guess I did. I put a question mark at the end because you are right, some people don't like to think that and I am one of those people.

I don't know if it's because I was raised to believe but the thought of just not existing occasionally keeps me up all night. Knowing how there is no way I can experience everything there is in this life, and that regardless everything I experience now will cease to exist one day...it all can be really upsetting.

AngryFemme · #8 2007-09-17, 23:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Standout

I don't know if it's because I was raised to believe but the thought of just not existing occasionally keeps me up all night. Knowing how there is no way I can experience everything there is in this life, and that regardless everything I experience now will cease to exist one day...it all can be really upsetting.

I feel you on that. I struggled with similar musings about my own death and the possibility of an afterlife. It kind of put the fire under me (no pun) to try to eke out as much joy, passion and love during this existence, since I felt quite certain that this would be the only go-'round. It's really affirmed how valuable life is, and has punctuated the fact that taking it for granted could quite possibly be the most dreadful mistake I could make while alive.